St John the Baptist Church

It's one of the oldest images of the church and that part of Fleet Street. There are a lot of differences with the present church.

The old watchmen (cops) that patrolled the streets at night used to fall asleep regularly on those church steps in Hill Street - they patrolled mainly to stop drunks from keeping the citizens awake, at the same time they called out the time every half-hour. If they met a drunk they ran him in till morning where he had to donate money to a flagon of beer.

A nice snippet of info Kaga, Next door to the church, further up Hill Street was the Bridewell, a type of prison - so a handy place to lock up the drunks. While the Spon Gate still existed, that too might have seen a few drunks.

Post copied from topic Holy Trinity Church on 30th Nov 2019 7:50 am

You're brilliant Anne The oldest pictures that I've got show a clock looking towards Spon Street and another towards Fleet Street. Like the clocks on Holy Trinity the location up the tower varied. I have a few images showing a clock on the Hill Street side but none of them are particularly old so originally those coming from Hill Street were denied the time. It makes sense that a clock looking towards Corporation Street didn't appear until the road was created.

Benjamin Poole/Taunton's book mention various payments on account of the clock in 1518 including a hand for the dial. In 1633 the clock was repaired. Then in 1681 chimes were put up in the church by order of the mayor, and two clock dials placed on the west and south sides of the tower. from this I assume there was just on clock face towards Hill Street until 1681. Unless I am reading it wrong. It is confusing as I think when they say the "clock" they are talking about the mechanics. Would they have had a dial inside the church perhaps ?

This is what a 1682 "clock" would look like, this is in Alcester Church

Well, they didn't have television so they liked to see the wheels go round.

Excellent references Anne. The south clock face would be the one looking towards Fleet Street (ish) and the west one was the Spon Street side.

Wow, that collection is absolutely amazing Neil ! The photo that astonishes me the most is this sad looking photo of St. John's church - and the most amazing thing is its possible age. St. John's underwent two major restorations, in the 1850s and the 1870s. When I first saw my own Wingrave image. I assumed it must be between the two projects (c1860s), with just over half already completed. But the photo on Flickr shows it in such a dilapidated state - could it be among the first ever photos in Coventry (or anywhere!) - before the 1850s restoration? Just fantastic! Post copied from topic Coventry photo collections on the Internet on 6th Jan 2021 10:07 pm

I think this is from the same era and yes, it may well be before the first part of the restoration. Some show the north end with finished crenulations but the south (left) still bald. The windows change, the door moves and the tower is repaired. I'm guessing that the south end was the second phase. At that point a new door is put in nearer Spon Street. The watercolour (at Watercolour World) is dated no later than 1843 and that shows no doors on the Spon/Fleet Street side and no curved wall. Watercolour of St John's

Nice work Helen (as always!). I'd completely forgotten about that first picture, showing the church in such a state. I've just found that photograph in a lovely little book called Coventry in Camera, where it is described as being immediately before its 1858-61 restoration by George Gilbert Scott. It's amazing to think that Wingrave took that in the late 1850s - earlier than I'd previously realised. The lower photo, probably taken around the same time as the one in my collection, can be dated, therefore, to after 1859, when the water fountain was erected. That watercolour you linked to, Helen, is lovely, but it is very flattering considering the state we know the church was in! Also, if it is accurate, then the turrets on the tower were still there, albeit in a dilapidated state. This perhaps helps us to date the wonderful photo that Neil linked to on Flickr, indicating that the missing turret had been removed post-1859 for replacement - whereas I'd previously thought it had completely crumbled away before the photo was taken. All good stuff, eh!

The Aylesford Collection images prior to 1800 of St John's don't seem to show crenulations, not even on the tower, just a wall with the same vertical decoration as the rest of the tower.. The turrets are there, but no taller than the rest of the wall and not very prominent. In later images you can see that the stairwell collapses, not just the turret, and it may be that early restorations caused already weak stonework to collapse? I've gone round and round in circles trying to work out the order of images and which might be artistic licence.

Hopefully a clearer, larger image here than my previous one of the statue by the door to St John's.

Photo taken 15 March 2022