Edward 'Duckfat' Bradshaw

I found a sad tale looking for books as usual - Trial of Edward Bradshaw. Thanks to the folks that put in the homework so that we could learn about 'Duckfat'. Mods note: Link no longer available

Is there any information regarding Mr Lines who was fatally wounded? I have searched the burial registers for St John, Holy Trinity and St Michael without finding him Would appreciate guidance on finding out more about him as I have a direct link to a Lines family - the head was a grocer in Spon End in 1818, where he died in 1843 Hope sks can assist

I strongly suspect it's a misspelling of 'Lynes', one of whom was a watch finisher living next-door-but-one to the Malt Shovel. By the way the name of the pub derives from a barley malt house which once occupied the area behind the pub and was last used as a funeral parlour! There's no doubt that Bradshaw was guilty of killing Mr Lines (or Lynes), only of whether it was premeditated or not.

Well Midland Red, I have found 'Linesey's' and will send the details and hope that you can find some fresh tracks from it. In 1841 census, two years before the incident, I can see two lots of Lines and a death. The death of William Lines, 1843, Oct/Nov/Dec; Vol. 16, p.277, the death certificate may reveal more. 1841 census, William Lines, born 1776, (shopkeeper) wife Mary, b. 1786 and Charlotte, born 1826 in Spon End. However, in 1842 census, William Lines b. 1826, (so aged 15 years) Elizabeth b. 1826, Charlotte born 1839 and Emma born 1840, living Spon End, South side.

Just re-checked, there is William Lines, buried 4th October 1843, age 71 years, St. Michael, so that should be easier to check the parish burials now.

Thanks for the speedy response The above William is my 3x great grandfather I don't know who this Lines family is [I do now - see post 9 below!]

Seems a coincidence though, same surname, same street, no older head of family on the census, there was a Charlotte born 1826 in your ancestors family. Could it be relatives? Did the murdered man have a brother I wonder in the vicinity? Don't think I am allowed to print the census out on here for you. Oh just looked, loads of Lines. 1841, John Lines, Great Butcher Row, age 55 1841, Thomas Lines, St. John Baptist, b. 1801 1841, John Lines, St John Baptist, b. 1811 The younger William Lines could be a relation of these.

It was getting late last night when I first looked at this I recall now that the 1841 Census is wrongly enumerated as both William and Elizabeth were 25(ish) not 15(ish), and this William is my 2xggfather, son of William Lines (d.1843) who was a shopkeeper in Spon End In 1851 William and Elizabeth were in Sovereign Place, and in 1861 and 1871 at 105 Spon End - bmd certificates support all this I only have one marriage for my 3xggfather (William to Mary) in 1812, and five children therefrom - he was shown as a widower, so having been previously wed, he may have had other children, one of whom might have been the victim of the incident PS I've been looking at Family Member Trees on Ancestry to see whether I could glean any further information on this line (pardon the pun!) As a word of warning to anyone researching their family tree using these, they are most unreliable - looking through common Lines links, I've been amazed at the number of mistakes where different Lines families have been mixed up. For example, I've seen a member tree for William Lines (b.1842) (my great grandnewphew in all this) being shown as died 1918 in Colorado, USA, when he actually died in Gulson Road Hospital in 1935 - he was featured in the press locally for being married for over 70 years!

Yes, I was getting a bit 'punchy' with it all last night and went to bed thinking about it all, thanks for your update this morning. I wasn't going to delve any further cos it is YOUR family and you did only ask about the burial in the first instant. However, I couldn't help another look. It did puzzle me with the first mistake with the '15 year olds' To begin with I thought they were twins Also, the victim is only mentioned as 'Mr. Lynes' with is frustrating without a christian name. I have looked through the various parish death records for September 1820 and can't find a suitable candidate. Unless we have both, just not found it I can only conclude that there is another spelling mistake on the parish burial records, Tine, Tyne, Lime etc. I'll have a look in the newspapers for a detailed article of the trial if I can find one, something might come up. Seeing as you have 'ancestry' look up Bradshaw on the criminal registers, it doesn't mention 'murder'only larceny/burglary. Frustratingly, I can't find the same court trial as the Herbert History team did, the date is a bit too early. Would have liked to have read the details of the hearing.

Do you know so far Midland Red, unless it says murder in the article of the trial, I don't reckon he murdered Mr Lynes. That's why we can't find him buried in 1820. In the free reading on Google Books of 'The History of Coventry' by Benjamin Poole, page 166 refers to it as 'the cutting and wounding' of Mr Lynes. And that's why it only states larceny on his criminal registers on Ancestry. Can't be positive because we haven't yet got the transcription of the trial. What do you make of it?

Some sources say the robbery took place at the Punch Bowl (104) and others say it took place at the Malt Shovel (96). A 'W. Lynes' watch finisher was living at 105 next door to the Punch Bowl in 1874, although this was more than fifty years after the robbery.

Thanks Dutchman. A lot of the details do seem conflicting don't they. I reckon Midland Red needs Morse on this one. Maybe someone will come up with the trial transcripts. But 'Robbery' seems to arise first and Mr Lynes' wounding almost secondary, which seems odd.

Not quite understanding this - Rayanne Byatt's article which you linked in the opening post clear states "A neighbour, Mr Lines, hearing the men escape, came to help the landlord but was fatally stabbed trying to disarm Edward of a knife he was holding" That's why I went looking for a burial in the days and weeks afterwards, with no luck Yes, he's my 2xggfather, son of William (d.1843) who was a grocer with a shop in Spon End (1841 census)

According to this, the sentence was only for burglary British Executions

The Punch Bowl is the dormer cottage in the centre of this photo sandwiched between the two three-storey buildings. It was destroyed during the war and is now the site of a Chinese takeaway.