Watch and Clock Industry in Coventry

Thank you MR for the detailed description.

Hoping you can all view this - an amazing time capsule of a property linked to watchmaking Apparently the Watch Museum have been contacted and made aware to hopefully salvage/save any historic watch-related items. Not sure of the background behind access or ownership but I do know where this house is.

Great find! Hopefully much of the content can be saved! Thanks for posting, Neil

Isn't it amazing how these 'windows of our past' keep popping up.

Recently off eBay from the US I bought a silver fob watch. I have for so long wanted to own such an item. I am aware of the watchmaking history in Coventry which is respected and important. I believe that Spon End was the hub. The movement is marked N Preston, London which I think only made movements to sell on. The hallmark is a Birmingham silver mark from 1832 which is during the William IV period. The watch was serviced in Dublin, Ireland for many years as I have the paper tokens. But I was totally amazed to discover that the inner & outer case (a duel case fob) were made by a William Naul in Albion Street, Coventry. Alas this street disappeared during the construction of the wonderful ring road but existed for quite a long time. Now it's in my hands as if it has come home. Who would have thought! Also..... for a fugee verge movement nearly 190 years in age, I can still wind it up and the watch ticks away. It may lose 15 minutes over 24 hours but I can forgive that. Not many things last so long these days.

Hi Members. Bill (Moriarty) is helping me out with a watch I have bought. What do you think Bill?

That's an excellent watch Gumnut. I don't let myself have stuff as fine as that because I'm very clumsy and lethal to objects. I dismayed myself last month by accidentally buying a rare and valuable print because it was cheap. Now I have to look after it

Snap! Well almost! I've had this watch since the late 60's after I inherited it from my Grandfather. It is very similar to yours, Gumnut, regarding the dial with slightly different engraving and scroll work. It is still in fine working order and still has three cleaning tickets in the case, dated 1882, 1886 and 1892 from J P Clare & Sons, 82 High Street, Bedford. In my younger days I often wore it in the conventional waistcoat manner, although I used a less valuable and much more recent pocket watch for daily use, as every wristwatch I attempted to wear stopped in a few days (must have been the "Geller Effect").

Hi Gumnut, Oh Dear, I'm rather in the firing line with something to come up with. Nice Australian wooden table by the way! I think we agreed that the casemaker was William Nock of St John Street, Coventry, with a caveat that William Ryley of St John Street took over the stamps issued by Birmingham Assay Office 1832 "ish", not William Naul. I suggested you could get a nice person to look up the 1841 census for St John Street to see what's going on - also the parish records (St Michael's)? to see if he kicked the bucket around then. I think there is a museum also at the B A O. What was it that was said about the watch in your group forum (you can ping me on that) that you were concerned about? The silver pair of cases are fine, Coventry, the photos are a little out of focus - that rivet near the hinge is a little odd, the movement must fit in the hinge snugly. The watch seems in excellent condition for over 200 years old and it's been halfway round the world. All the screws are perfect - it's either been really professionally restored or kept in a safe. As regards the movement, I don't think it is Coventry! I think if you could find out more on N Preston, London (they were working in a small area in London), so either the goldsmiths' hall or, again, a census, might be the key to proving it is the movement for the case, as there would have been more marriages of case to movement and they might have an example. You have the later style regulator on the balance which is kosher, but Coventry movements were very traditional so the engraving was old English, so the word FAST was spelt, FAFT. This went on right up to Alan Burdess watches, and the graduations were unique to each area. Coventry had a diamond shape in a cross. Those ones look like fleur de lis (there are books on this I think). I would lean towards the Liverpool area, what with the name Preston on it, and on the cock what looks like a Liver Bird! Could the building have been constructed then? It's only an idea, but they did honour events like coronations. The only other thing I would question, and it's probably because it's out of focus, is on the second photo that fuzee cone looks like it has teeth missing. All in all I think you did very well, I'm envious.

William Nock is living in Cook Street in 1841 and that adress is given when he died 27th June 1844. The house in Cook Street is for sale in September 1944 and it is described as a newly erected dwelling so he could have recently moved there. William Ryley was living in Jordan Well in 1941. There is nobody called Nock or Ryley living in St John Street which seems to be occupied mostly by weavers. William Nock went to the Fleur de Lys public house in Smithford Street on the 27th June 1944, called for a glass of porter, before he could drink it he fell down dead!

Thank you everyone for your responses and fantastic information. Earlsdon Kid, our watches are so very similar, the dial and hands are exact and the scrolling/engraving nearly match. Mine was serviced in Amargh, I have 4 or 5 service tokens but they are undated. I had to buy mine from the US, would have loved to have inherited it. Bill, I'm glad that you like the watch. It's in great condition (far better than me), I think it was just very well cared for. I've had a closer look at the fusee cone (I'm learning the terminology now) and I think it was due to the poor photo as I have zoomed in and the teeth are all intact. I had never noticed the engraved bird before... well spotted, I agree there that it's a Liver Bird. I have also read during my searches it mentioned about the fleur de lys being a noted sign of a Liverpool watch. We are slowly putting the puzzle together. Are Liverpool watches regarded highly or just run of the mill? I am still slightly confused on something, are these movements not anything like a Massey or English table roller? Anne, can I get you to do another search for me, for the year 1831. I really appreciate you helping me out, I'm quite clueless with that kind of thing. Thanks again everyone.

Here is another photo which may also help. Does the serial number 2936 mean anything? Can this also be used to track down the maker etc?

My Atkins ancestors were in the watchmaking trade, and came originally from Clerkenwell, though there is evidence they were in Coventry before that. Edward Atkins was baptised in Holy Trinity, Coventry 1791. Apprenticed 3 Feb 1807 to William Hale, Watchmaker, Coventry. Edward = Mary Clemson Holy Trinity, 7 Mar 1821. Died by 1851 Census, or estranged from wife living in Coulston household, lodging house, Gosford Street. 5 children, 3 born in Clerkenwell but baptised Coventry, St John. In the book 'The mystery of the Coventry Cappers' It states that the Watchmaking trade suffered a depression in the 17th century until 'about 1750 when the first of the Rotherhams John Bottrill began to develop the craft again.'

I think I had better repeat the data I gave to you, Gumnut, so everyone can see the info. The book, Watch Case Makers of England: A History and Register of Gold & Silver Watch Case Makers of England: 1720 - 1920 (NAWCC Bulletin Supplement 20, Spring 1994), Philip T Priestley. Page 173 - maker's mark and address WR, William Ryley, St John Street, Coventry, 1790. Now I assume this info has been obtained from the Birmingham assay records. Page 173 - maker's mark WN 3rd Nov 1830, William Nock (late Wm Ryley ) case and pendant maker, St John Street, Coventry. Now I assume someone died and William Riley took over the stamps! So Gumnut's watch case could have been made by Ryley. Anne said he was in Jordan Well later, 1841? It's near, it could also be his son. It took me forever to find this info again (you can see the stamp WN on Gumnut's last photo). I'm not a watch expert, unfortunately and really I was just relaying the info that you had perhaps picked the wrong casemaker. Table roller and the other one you said, these are just escape mechanisms, you probably would not see the difference between a lever movement and them,unless you recognised the maker and slight variations, but of course yours is verge, it mostly predates them. Carousel or tourbillon, now they are the ones worth a king's ransom. All these cities had special makers, desirable watches but as I said the plates were stamped out in Prescot area, shipped to Coventry, built up and the best taken to London, stripped, refined, hallmarked London and sold. Those without the London stamp were classed country watches, that's why later Rotherham's had an office in London to obtain the London hallmark. Of course all makers sold generally. Hope this helps. Oh, I put Alan Burdess in post 196, it should have been Adam. Sorry.

Sorry Gumnut, the 1841 census is the first detailed census available