Helen F - Modelling the city

Hi Foxcote. Yes, the constant trickle of tips and pictures from everybody is unique to modern internet forums. We are crowd sourcing but with each of us at a different task. The number of sources of information on the net is amazing and it helps to have people giving a shout out about what they've found. Much of my early work was fitting as many of the Pictures of Coventry onto the maps as I could. It wasn't easy. Many of the pictures don't mention house numbers and even where they do, it's very hard to work out which one is which. At first it wasn't always obvious even which side of the street the photographer was looking at. I then moved on to paintings and drawings. It's often a clue from a photograph that pin points which building I'm looking at in a drawing. Just the other day I identified the location of one of Dr Troughton's drawings that is just labelled 'Malt House Gosford Street'. By matching an unusual window from the building next door and looking at the Board of Health map I worked out the drawing was of the building that preceded the chapel just opposite Whitefriars Lane. I'd love to share the drawings I've collected but they're not mine to publish. But what I will do is make a catalogue of how I identified each building and where to get the source material if someone wanted to look at it. Mcsporran, yes I have thought about a digital model, especially after the Off the Map recreation of Pudding Lane appeared on the net. Seriously cool! Though any graphics I do could be used as texture for a digital model, so it wouldn't be wasted. Thanks for your interest

For most of you these views will be familiar but these are my interpretations of the Spon Street Gate. They're not exact copies but I think they get the idea. I'm still feeling my way in how to reproduce the elements of buildings and then make them 3D.

Hi Helen not sure where this part of Coventry is, I bought this a while ago Lady Godiva, not sure if it helps for old Coventry .

Thanks Morgana, I'm not sure that it's any part of Coventry but it's pictures like this that are giving me extra clues. There are a series of pictures of Godiva and none of them look the same. Most I fear are purely imaginary or based on medieval buildings wherever the artist lived, but some of them are more intriguing, especially those that show one or more of the spires. Pictures of Broadgate are the same. Plenty of them but none of those that purport to show the spires are similar in design or similar to what was there by the time accurate drawings were made but later architecture dominated. I suppose the answer would be to identify the artist and the date. Artists who painted after the areas had been demolished and/or had lived a long way from Coventry are less likely to have recorded realistic views. However I can't know if those artists were working from another work that genuinely captured the view. I tend to look for two or more images that agree with each other (assuming one isn't the copy of the other) and/or look for some element that survived to be captured later. Your picture is George Jones (1833) and while it might be Coventry, there are no clues as to where. This one is Adam van Noort (1586). The date is right but the architecture isn't. Marshall Claxton (1850). The buildings aren't bad but not quite right. It certainly doesn't fit anywhere I can think of. Joseph Sharp (1887). Possible but I don't think so. Jules Lefebvre (1890). Looks nothing like Coventry. John Collier (1898). Another iconic image but doesn't look like Coventry. 19th century woven silk Stevengraph. Both of these are of known views of Coventry. Actually they are of the almost same location (Broadgate west) but with a row of buildings removed from the second image. This one interests me but the date 18something would be too late. It looks like it copies something earlier but what? If it was genuine it could be Broadgate east or Earl Street/Jordan Well north. Emanuel Leutze 1866. Possible but not from that date and the clock tower doesn't ring any bells (pun intended). Don't know who his is by or when but it could potentially be the top of Cross Cheaping, east side. A later view of that stretch could be this image

Helen, There seems to be some more "Britain from above" added for Coventry, don't know if you have looked recently. Some very detailed. I like this one as the fair is on Pool Meadow ! The City Centre 1920

Thanks Anne. Every time I think they've added all there is to see, a few more pop up. There are some nice ones covering the south side of New Street now and a couple of the southern part of Much Park Street. You don't always realise the area you want is tucked at the edge of a picture centred elsewhere but I've filled a lot of gaps in using Britain From Above by repeated viewing. One of the aerial photos I'd like to get my hands on is one of the Hotchkiss Works of Gosford Street before the second factory was built. There's a blurry, masked out version on page 78 of Godiva's Heritage, Coventry's Industry. Even a version without the printing dots would help. I wonder if the History Centre has a copy or even other pics that haven't made to BFA? Since the factories were the usual target of the photography the centre of the city is often tantalisingly out of focus but it's the more outlying parts that survived into the age of aerial photography anyway.

Be warned Helen that aerial views can sometimes be misleading. For example an aerial view from 1949 gave the impression that a timber-framed building at 113 Gosford Street had been replaced by a new building but a 1953 view only recently uploaded and taken from a slightly different angle shows that the timber-framed building was still intact and that the new building was on the opposite side of Whitefriars Lane.

Too right Dutchman. I've been fooled by which building was which on many an occasion but I've got a sketch of 113 so that wasn't one that tripped me up. The sketches can be very deceptive too because it's easy to lose an entire set of buildings because they're obscured by something in the foreground. Gradually I'm linking a picture to most map plots. Gosford street is one of those I'm most satisfied with.

The area behind No.113 always gave me the creeps at night. I had no idea at the time it had once been a funeral parlour!

Think how creepy it would have been if you'd known!

I have had an email from Britain from above to say that they have put the final batch of pictures on the site. I think there are few on there that I have not seen before. Shame we can't look forward to any more new ones

There may be more collections they haven't acquired? We can only hope. I must have a look at the one's at the history centre, they may be a different set. Alternatively they may have some taken from the spires that haven't been widely released?

Ok folks, I'll be passing on Sunday 24th July about 9ish. I could stop off for breakfast (eg Toby Binley) if anyone wants to see the final version of my survey of Coventry's old streets. It's over 800 pages long now, so I haven't printed it but I could bring my laptop along if anyone's interested. Sorry it's a funny day of the week. I still haven't worked out how to share what I've learnt but I'm on the verge of starting to build a virtual version. Below are a few early trials. I'm rather chuffed with the filigree bargeboard and the Tudor glass.

As many of you will know, I have parked the physical model for the short term and have gone digital. The research project is well advanced and while I'm sure that there are more images to find, I'm giving that a bit of a rest. I think I've got a good grip on the old city and selected 1650 as the closest to modern images and maps but still feature the wall. It's actually a good date because the wall was refurbished for the Civil War. I've got a number of Coventry 3D projects going at once. One is to work out the height map of the city and I have mixed feelings about its usefulness and may go back to scratch. The next is learning how to use software called Blender to create complex shapes and get them looking realistic. The third is laying out the city on the map and working out what each building looked like. This is what I'm calling the tacking stage and uses simple timber frames. I'm not using the sculptured landscape because it's hard enough to work in 3 dimensions without adding a fourth at the same time. Once I've worked out the layout I'll work on the hills. I thought it was time to show you a few pictures. The first is the Gosford Gate area. Without a proper map for 1650 it's a bit of a guess exactly how the gateway looked on the ground but this seems to fit with the images from both sides. The next is the view towards Gosford with Cox Street running along the bottom of the picture. It gives you an impression of how many structures are involved. The next is of St Mary's and the surrounding area. I don't plan to build the old Cathedral but in 1650 some of the old walls would have still been partially visible. Top right you can see Butcher Row and the old gateway into the Cathedral forecourt, later to become one half of the Spotted Dog. Top left is the remains of the Bishop's Palace. In the middle you can see why Hill Top was a funny dog leg, respecting the old structures. Another of the Priory with New Street top right. Top left you can just see one of the priory mills that later saw the new Priory Street run past it, over the river. The last is part of my modelling experiment, trying to reimagine the Spon Street Gate. Well I'm having fun, no matter what happens.

Oh my Helen, I'm completely in awe of the fantastic work you've done - it's really by far the nearest any of us will get to that time machine we've all been hankering for! Well done and thank you for what you've achieved so far, it's absolutely marvellous, and making me more than ever want to go back in time to see the Coventry of old.